Season 1 Episode 3

Hi, I'm Alex. And I'm Brenda. Welcome to conversational counseling or Counseling and discipleship. Meet. Justification is nothing to prove, nothing to lose because God says I'm not guilty. I don't have to prove anything. I don't have anything to lose. I'm free. Really, what we begin to see is throughout our lives, the glory and grace of God grow so much as we really understand who God is, what He's done for.

How much he loves us.

Okay, Brenda, we're doing these three things and we are, are just laughing because we didn't always say there were gonna be three simple things. And our three things this, this time are the three shuns now we're not. Um, No longer speaking to anyone or not having any communica, uh, fellowship with them, that, that kind of shun the shuns, t i o n, um, justification.

Sanctification. Glorification. And as I just said, um, there have been volumes written about these three subjects, but somehow we're gonna cover them in 30 minutes. Yeah, easy, easy for us and easy for the listeners as well. But actually I think the challenge here, and I think that we're gonna be able to do it, is to present it in a way that is once again digestible and can be metabolized.

Into our own lives and then be able to be useful as we minister to other people, Lord willing. So that's our challenge today. Um, so the three shuns that we wanna talk about are kind of big words, but we're gonna unpack it and explain what they are. It's justification. Sanctification and glorification. I agree.

All right. So Alex, um, you know, we said we'd have three things, but sometimes our three things are gonna have babies. Yes. And so we got baby peas that we're gonna add to these three theological concepts, but hopefully this will break it down and even make it more simple. So, under justification, what we wanna remember, the p there is the penalty of sin has been.

Okay. The penalty, that's the P word we're looking for in sanctification. The power of sin has been broken. Mm-hmm. Okay. So power is the word we're looking for then. And then in glorification, the presence of sin has been removed. Mm-hmm. Okay. So these concepts are actually really important for us to remember, and we've been talking about hooks and frameworks and orientation, but they really do help us begin.

To know how to enter in into our own hearts and our own lives and know where we are. And we, we've been talking a lot about the story, where we are in God's story. Um, and then, you know, what we have to look forward to in God's story. Yeah. I think what we see even in our own lives or as when we're talking to someone else, is we see someone.

Stuck in a way that we can begin to identify that they're stuck in one of these three concepts, or they're missing one of these three concepts, and I think that's gonna become clearer as we flesh it out. Yeah. So one, maybe one easy way that I can explain this in my own life is that, um, I came to faith.

In a tradition that had a very big emphasis on evangelism. Mm-hmm. And because of that, um, I was always taught the gospel. I was always taught that the penalty of my sin had been paid. But what I had not been taught is that the power had been broken. Mm-hmm. And that, that was going to be progressive. And we'll talk about that in just a second.

Mm-hmm. But what happened essentially is every time I sinned, I went back to thinking I had to be re-saved. Okay. I went back to justification. Right. Because it's like uhoh, somebody's gotta pay for this sin. I need to go back and I need to, you know, rededicate my life to the Lord. Yes. I need to get re-saved.

Sort of laugh and say I've been saved like seven times, baptized 11 times, right? Because in this time of my life, I just never understood that there was actually that I wasn't going to stop sinning. Just because the penalty for my sin had been paid in justification, right? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And that became a trap for me and very discouraging to think that I wasn't a Christian and I certainly wasn't a very good Christian if I was one.

And, um, sort of to your point, there was something very, very essential to my Christian walk that I was missing. So if you. Stood that justification is that point in time. It is that declared, it's really a legal word, right? It is. The gavel was lowered and not guilty was declared over you. You wouldn't have continued to go back and go back and go back because you would've recognized that that point in time led you into immediately.

Process of sanctification where the power of sin is being broken. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that for me, I didn't really understand that in justification. I mean, I was adopted mm-hmm. As God's child. And so, um, I was brought into his family. That means he wrote my name in his book. Mm-hmm. And he wasn't ever gonna erase it.

Didn't matter how bad I sin. Right. He was never gonna erase my name that he had put in. The Holy Spirit was, which is the promise guaranteeing all the inheritance I have in Christ, that there was union with Christ and it was inseparable. There was nothing that was gonna ever separate me from the love of God in Christ.

Mm-hmm. But I didn't recognize that. Mm-hmm. And so a lot of people, and I would say especially a lot of people in the south gets stuck right there. Right. And they can't understand like, well, if I'm a Christian now, why do I keep sinning? Right? And why do I feel so discouraged? And a lot of feelings. Right. I don't.

I don't feel like I have the Holy Spirit or I don't feel like God loves me, and we were talking about some of the lyrics or the narratives or things we tell ourselves in justification or why it's important to really be grounded and understand. What this means that we come into union with Christ mm-hmm.

And our sins are forgiven. Mm-hmm. And we are clothed with the righteousness of Christ. Right. When justification happens. Yeah. Because I can say personally, the way I get, um, justification and sanctification twisted is I forget that it is God and it is Christ himself who does the justifying. And so I bring justification in the sanctification.

Mm-hmm. And think I have to continue to keep proving myself to. Yeah, it's not a point in time, but I've gotta keep proving myself. So I'm on the treadmill of keep pleasing him to keep doing what's right. Performance's right. Keep performing. Yeah. Right. So you mentioned gospel lyric. One of the, the, uh, gospel lyric is a concept I learned from para colle, and Pero does a great job of reminding us those.

Things that we need to hold close to our hearts. The, the kind of catchy and easy to remember so that when I'm discouraged, I can access them. One of the gospel lyrics that I love for, uh, justification is nothing to prove, nothing to lose because God says I'm not guilty. I don't have to prove anything. I don't have anything to lose.

I'm free to live. Um, and then the other one that I really love goes along with that same lawyer courtroom, um, legal terminology. For me, this is probably the most precious one, and it's that the courtroom is closed. And that's really important to me because in this process of sanctification, I tend to wanna take myself back into the courtroom and retry myself.

Yes, over and over and over again. And when I do that, I put myself in the position of judge and everyone else is looking on while I judge myself to deem whether I'm worthy of God's love. Mm-hmm. And so I actually have a visual that I've created in my mind, and I, you're gonna hear me talk about visual theology a lot because I, I can access a picture more quickly than I can.

Language and logic sometimes. Yeah. And so my picture is these big, heavy courtroom doors with a big pad. Chain and a big padlock on it, that it is locked. It is closed. Alex, you are not gonna take yourself back in that place and try yourself again. Mm-hmm. Or maybe if you struggle with the opinions of others, you're not gonna take yourself back into that courtroom and let other people become your judge because you've already been declared not guilty, you've been declared beloved.

You've been declared accepted, accepted, approved. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And that's really, if we are not anchor. And the love of God for us in Christ. Right there. Mm-hmm. Man, it just jacks us up moving forward, doesn't it? Yes. Yes. On so many levels. On so many levels. I know. Um, One of the things is just as we think about sanctification and the power of sin being broken and the penalty of sin and how God begins to see us, or how God does see us, once we have put our trust in Christ, um, I, I, you will hear people say, well, when God sees you, he just, you know, he sees Jesus.

And for me that was such a hard concept because I thought, well, I'm me and I'm clearly not Jesus. So I don't understand how, when God sees me, he's seeing Jesus. Cuz I don't, you know, there, I know me. Um, but one of the sweetest just visuals that the Lord gave me was the day I met my grandson. Mm-hmm. Um, my grandson was three and a half years old, the first time that I ever laid eyes on him.

And um, and as much as I love my own children and I love my friend's children and I like children, but I'm not somebody who necessarily signs up, you know, to be the teacher in vbs and, um, you know, didn't just love babysitting as a child. And so I was sort of like, wow, here's this three and a half year old little boy that's about to come into my life, who is a member of my family, but I've never seen him and I don't know how I'm gonna respond to him.

Like, I don't know, like, emotionally, what's that gonna be like? Am I gonna connect? Am I gonna know Right that he belongs? And the minute he came up to the front door and I opened that door and I laid eyes on him, I was completely overwhelmed because I saw the face of my son. Mm-hmm. On my grandson. It is unmistakable.

It is undeniable. And um, and the thing is, is that my grandson is distinctively my grandson, right. He is his own person. But to look at him is to see a miniature version of my son is to see my son. Mm-hmm. And the Lord really began to show me, like, Brenda, this is how I look at you. Mm-hmm. Right? Like it was just such a beautiful picture of you or you, but when I look at you, I see my son, right.

And I see the family resemblance. And I can't tell you why this is, except it just is. But compared to every other three and a half year old in the whole world, they all paled in comparison. And all I could do was look at him and wanted to hug him and love him and talk to him and know him and engage, like I was completely captivated.

Mm-hmm. Completely into him. Mm-hmm. Wanted to treasure him, wanted to hold him. I was approving, like, it just, it didn't matter if he came in. He was three and a half. He wasn't like he was gonna come in here and, you know, be perfect. He was a three and a half year old, but it didn't matter what he did. Mm-hmm.

Because I just, I just, it was just that instantaneous when I saw my son's face. In his, it just changed everything. Mm-hmm. And it was so beautiful. And so that has been a constant reminder to me of just how, how God looks at us when he sees the face of Jesus on us. Well, I've heard you say this illustration before, but every time I'm like, this is just for me, this is my illustration that God wants me to know because it is so hard for me to grasp that he is not looking at my performance.

Yeah. You know, one of the things that. I remember actually, you come into this story, Brenda, I remember being a young mom. You were doing a mom's group and you were teaching like techniques for raising children. Mm-hmm. And all these things, you know, I remember where we were sitting and I remember hearing you speak the first time and being like, I need to know.

All that she knows, and I need to know it right now. And I went up to you afterwards. I mean, Brenda, we are in our twenties. Yeah. Yeah. So I run, I go up to you afterwards and I say, can you gimme a list of all the things I need to know? And I've got so much to learn and I don't know all these things. And my daughter is like nine months old and I don't, you know, and you, you're like, take a deep.

The Lord is gonna bring these things to you in his time when he knows you need 'em. And it just pointed to this bigger struggle that I've had throughout my whole Christian life, and it is letting go of the truths of my justification and trying so hard now to again, prove my worthiness and thinking that okay.

God did it there. He justified me. It was all his work, but now I gotta take over. Mm-hmm. In sanctification. Yeah. Because I've got, I've gotta do something, I've gotta be something. I've gotta walk worthy as if the way I walk is gonna make me worthy. Mm-hmm. Of God's love. Yeah. Well that's really good because you were just talking about, you know, the Council of God is gonna show you, it's gonna be over time.

Mm-hmm. And this really brings us to what sanctification is all about. Yes. But it is the process. Um, by which God is working out what he is working in. Mm-hmm. And we are cooperating with that process. Um, but it is a process. And you know, sin is stubborn. Mm-hmm. I'm running through judges right now. We have the cycle, you know, and the sin, and then there's oppression and then they cry out for deliverance and then God sends a deliver and then there's a time of peace.

And what really struck me, Um, I think it was like the first round was eight years and then there was 10 years, and then there was 18 years, and then there was seven years. Like they had to, I mean, it was a long time before they cried out to the Lord. And of course they had to deliver who could, um, manipulate if you will, or who could intervene on external circumstances, but couldn't change the heart.

Mm-hmm. And so in sanctification, what God is really doing is he is changing our heart. Mm-hmm. Right. First. And in changing our heart, making us more holy, if you will, in our conduct or more set apart or. Are like Jesus in the way we, we live in the, what we think about, um, how we feel, what we do, um, that we are lining up to be more like Jesus.

Mm-hmm. And, um, and I love the sort of the analogy of like, if you think about sanctification as the beginning point, and if we can think about glorification, which we'll talk to as our ending point, um, and the in between is like we are moving. Toward heaven. Mm-hmm. We are moving toward the end, but the, the in between can look really, really messy.

Mm-hmm. It's like the trajectory is we're moving up, but in real time it looks like we're going up and down, up and down, up and down, up and down. Right. And I've heard it described like being on a, um, escalator and you're the yo-yo. Yeah. Like you are moving up toward Christlikeness, you are moving closer to heaven, you know, physically Yeah.

Toward Christlikeness, spiritually. But your life looks a lot more like that, yo-yo uh, going up because there is so much sin and there is so much suffering. Mm-hmm. Um, that is intersecting our lives at the same time. Yeah. It's that becoming what we already are. Yeah, I love that. Like it's already true in the Heavenlys and we are, um, experiencing it here on earth.

And the hardest thing for me is trusting that this is a quote by Elizabeth Prentis I always loved. She was a woman who wrote books and she wrote the him more love to the, and she influenced Elizabeth Elliot, but Elizabeth says, um, the same God that's in charge of. Ation is in charge of our sanctification.

That's right. That we can trust him and we wanna pull control back from him to make it look like what we think it needs to look like when it needs to look like that. Yeah. But the other thing that strikes me, Brenda, is I remember a few years ago I was taking a counseling class and, um, someone made the comment, I cannot remember who it was, but that sanctification was, uh, drawing nearer to.

Mm. And knowing God more deeply, and I, this may sound crazy, but I, I've been a Christian for a long, long time, but I remember thinking, that's not right. Mm-hmm. It's become, it's becoming more like Jesus. It's not knowing Jesus more deeply. Mm. And then I was like, Alex, like, it just shows. It just shows my struggle, right?

Mm-hmm. I have to be something. I'm gonna have to, I have to do something. It's not being something. Mm-hmm. I have to perform for him, not be in relationship with him. And then I began to realize that dad's inextricably linked. Like I can't separate as I know Christ more deeply, I will become more like him.

Exactly. As I become more like him, I will know him more deeply. I can't separate the two. But for me, I took the biggest. Sigh of relief almost, of like, wow, I've been so focused on what I'm supposed to do. They haven't really thought about how sanctification is knowing Christ. Mm-hmm. Knowing him, watching him as I read the scripture, watching him interact with me through the spirit and his word, like watching his work in other people's lives and being.

By him being drawn in by his beauty and that that changes me. Mm-hmm. And so it was another paradigm shift for me. Mm-hmm. To realize that it's not just being more like him, it's knowing him more deeply. Yeah. That's so good. And I think we, I've talked a lot in the past about just we're transformed as a scripture says from one glory to the next how by.

No, no. Bible holding his glory as we're drawing near to him, the Holy Spirit is doing some work in us. Mm-hmm. And that is transforming us. And then the doing is an overflow. Mm-hmm. Of the being. Mm-hmm. I, I do think that's super important. Well, I think we need to come back to the practicalities of some of these, but let's talk about glorification.

Yeah. Um, I said glorification, the pee was, the presence of sin is removed. Mm-hmm. So when we talk about glorification, what are we talking about? Well, let's, let's add the presence of sin and suffering is removed. Yeah. I know we've pulled sin. Yeah. And the effects of sin, maybe. Yeah. Yeah. Which is suffering the presence of sin and the effects of sin.

So yeah. So we're really talking about our future hope. It's the looking ahead, and to me it is. Um, it's the only way to orient and maintain hope. When I'm on that up and down of I'm not getting this, yeah, I'm struggling with the same thing. Again, I'm 50 years old. I'm still struggling with the same sense I struggled with in my twenties, but just remembering that there is a day when, um, I will be unburdened of myself that.

Yeah. And your physical pain Yes. That you had today. Yeah. In your hips, probably as a result of driving to Chattanooga. So, um, yeah, I think that hope of heaven, um, having an eternal mindset, knowing that there's an end game, and knowing that we win in the end. Mm-hmm. Uh, is really, really beautiful. Hope is an incredible motivator when we're struggling with sin or when we are enduring some sort of suffering in our lives.

Mm-hmm. And one of the things I love, one of the scriptures I've come to love is the scripture that says those he justified. Mm-hmm. He also glorified. Mm-hmm. And I think it's really interesting that Paul doesn't mention sanctification in that little verse, because again, I think, like you said, we get really fixated on the in between, which again, we need to be faithful and diligent and you know mm-hmm.

Cultivate our walk with Christ. But I think that's the, the security is not, In the sanctification, the security is the working out. Mm-hmm. Of our justification. And it's the in between, but that security is in our justification. Mm-hmm. And, um, and you know, and then in our sanctification is where. Yeah, we're working out what God is working in and we are becoming, and that becoming becomes a doing.

So let's talk a little bit about how does this help us orient when we're talking to other people? I think we've said a little bit more. I mean, seems like we've talked a little bit about how we've oriented in our own lives, but. Why, why are some of these concepts important, these three things important when we begin to have discussions with other people?

Well, I think when we hear someone deeply discouraged in their own Christian life, we can usually pinpoint that they are, um, they're taking God's work of the sanctification or even justification onto themselves, or they're not believ. Glorification is to come. So when we hear deep discouragement in the Christian life, I think we can usually hear, there's gonna be one area in particular where they're struggling.

Either you know, the penalty hasn't been removed, the power hasn't removed, or the presence won't be removed, and we can kind of listen for that under the discouragement. Yeah, I think that's really good. And so what might be some antidotes or some ways that we. Meet them in that. I mean, one of the things I think about in justification, and this is why we talk about preaching the gospel daily to ourselves.

Mm-hmm. But I, I do think that for most of us, um, our faith is often attacked at the point of our assurance. Mm-hmm. Because I think the enemy really knows if we're, again, if we're not rooted and anchored in that, we're going to get off. Mark. I can remember a friend of mine who was a helicopter pilot would just say when he would do, um, instrument flying, if the instruments were off one degree.

Right, right. You'd start off and you'd be fine, but if you get a hundred, 200, 3, 400, the further the further miles you went mm-hmm. Off based off that instrument, the further off the mark you go. Mm-hmm. And so I think this is where assurance and, you know, I was recently meeting with a woman who, um, you know, I wouldn't say she definitely, um, I think she definitely knew the Lord, but she didn't really have that assurance.

And we, we actually. We actually stopped what we were doing and just said, would you, do you wanna just pray a prayer right now? She didn't have that sort of, that point in time. Mm-hmm. Not everybody does. Mm-hmm. Not everybody does, and that's okay. But for her, she was at this new place with the Lord that she was really doubting and getting beaten up.

And because she didn't have this real clear picture, she'd been kind of churched her whole life. She'd been, you know, read the Bible and we just really stopped there and had sort of this prayer of like, faith of really assurance, of knowing that I know, that I know that I know that, I know that today is that day.

Mm-hmm. And um, and there was just a real relief and a real sweetness with her. Mm-hmm. But to your point, I think the, the areas of justification is we either want approval, Or we feel like we have to perform. And so we have to just continue to remind people, um, of what God, what, what Jesus has done for them.

Yeah. And so I use that visual theology of the courtroom being closed a lot. I d I develop that with people. What, what I hear a lot from people, and I have experienced this in my own life, is, is this, um, I know people can't see me, but they say, I've got it here, and they're pointing to their head. Like, I know that, but I don't know that.

And they're pointing to their heart like, I can't get the truth Yeah. Of these rich doctrines down into my heart where I live out of that. Right. And so, again, I, I really think visual theology is an important way to do that. We, we attach deep, um, theological truth to simple. Images that we can grasp ahold of in our mind.

Um, and so the courtroom is a great one. I even, another way is when I hear someone talking and I hear them saying, you know, Well, I mean, I just, I think that this is the right thing to do, but then my mom got mad at me when I, and, and, and then just to be able to say, okay, let's pause right there. Like, who's the judge in the courtroom right now?

Like, take 'em right back to that visual theology. Make it really practical. And what is your mom saying? Is she able to declare you not guilty? Would it matter if she did? Doesn't matter. Like the only one we wanna hear not guilty from is the supreme god of all the universe. And once he says it, it doesn't matter what anyone else says.

Yeah. And so we just keep developing that as a vi. We, we build that visual around the theology right into the struggle where they are. Yes. With the real peak. Bowl that they're struggling with that. And so I, I just find that that pushes that down. And then again, there is something about journaling and, and praying through concepts like this.

Mm-hmm. Like we just asked the Lord when we realize that we aren't getting it. In our heart and we journal that out, like, what is true of me? Mm-hmm. Because the, the penalty of sin has been removed. Mm-hmm. Who am I I was gonna say, I think we could link in our show notes we have, um, Bob Kellman has two great handouts.

One is, who am I in Christ and who am I two Christ. Mm-hmm. Yes. And those are just great resources to look up those scriptures, to go over those. That, that's, that's true. This is what God is declaring over us. Mm. And for us to walk in that truth. Um, and then I just think, you know, in sanctification, God is, I always say God is not in a rush.

Mm-hmm. And God is so patient. Mm-hmm. And he's so kind. Mm-hmm. And again, that's not to say that we trie with our sin or we don't take our sins seriously in any way, but. Most of the people, many of the people that I'm coming in contact with, like they're sincere. They really wanna please God, but they're struggling.

The very thing they wanna do, they're not doing. Mm-hmm. You know, and, and we understand. We understand that struggle. There's areas in our own lives where that is happening. But just to even, I think even for us to realize that God is even using our struggle with sin. Mm-hmm. To deepen our faith and our understanding of his grace.

And I remember one of my pastors said, God is the only one that can use our sin sinlessly. Mm. And by that our wrestle with sin, our actual consequences of sin, all of those things God is using to help us see, um, to have a greater affection for who God is. Mm-hmm. To have a greater affection for Christ, to, to want him and his ways more than we want me and my ways.

Mm-hmm. And my sin. Mm-hmm. And so the Lord know. He's sovereign. He knows how long he, that we need to struggle in a certain area. Um, you know, again, we have a responsibility in that, but he also is sovereign even over that. Mm-hmm. And, um, and I think we can get so discouraged with so much self-condemnation and, um, And like you said, going back that self combina condemnation takes us or other people condemning us, takes us right back to the courtroom.

Right. And the reality is, is in justification, before we were justified, God was our judge. Mm-hmm. But in sanctification, he's our father. Yeah. And we're adopted. And you think about the difference between punishment and discipline. Punishment is I'm gonna pay you back for the wrong you've done. Discipline is, I'm gonna correct you.

Mm-hmm. So you can move forward differently. And don't you think it's true when, when we. Stuck in sanctification, or we would get really discouraged. One of the things that we're doing is we are looking at a particular area where we wanna see growth. Mm-hmm. Like, maybe it's a particular fruit of the spirit, you know, why am I not more loving?

Um, why am I not more patient? Yeah. Patie. Yeah, that's a big one. And, and we don't see the ways that God's d working other things in us. Yes. And, and so often it's just trusting that we don't always see the way he's working because we want it to look like this right now. Yeah. And that comes from comparison.

Yes. It's gonna kill comparison's gonna kill us. Yeah. In sanctification. Yeah. That's such a great point, because I think in comparison, really the only comparison I need to make is where was I? Where am I compared to the day I was just, Oh my goodness. God has done such an amazing work in my life. I'm not even the same person, but looking forward when I, when I think about glorification and the presence of sin being removed, and there's no more sin in me, right?

But there's a long way to go to be like Jesus. Mm-hmm. And to have the realization of that. Mm-hmm. So I think if we're gonna compare on any scale, we have to, just to compare what has, what's the work God's already done and what's the work that God still is doing. Don't compare to other people because God has already worked in us and he is going to continue to work in us until he takes us home.

And at that point, whether or not I think the, the work was complete enough or not, doesn't matter cuz it's over. Mm-hmm. And then it will be. Fully complete. And then to go back to that concept of it's not just how we perform or how we look more like Christ, but how we grow closer to Christ. You know, one thing we, we can forget is that, um, when we don't see character changes, we can become discouraged.

But if we clinging to the truth of the gospel, we often grow in affection for Christ. He still loves. Yeah. Even when I am not patient, right, he still loves me even when I am not kind. And so one, you know, one thing we can look at is like, you know, Lord, I am not growing in kindness, um, to my husband, but I am, I can see that I have more affection for you, that you spent three years day in, day out with these disciples who just didn't get it, and you never spoke an unkind word.

Ever one die. Yeah. I'm like, yeah, you never did it. And like I am more in awe of who Christ is. As I see my own struggle with sin. I'm more in awe of his perfection. And so I, I, I see my affection for him growing even sometimes when I don't see my, um, appearance. Yeah. Like, like him growing. Yeah. And I think so often when that greater affection grows, then the fruit grows, the other things grow, right?

Mm-hmm. And I, and. I like sort of the picture. Of course we don't have it where you can see it right now, but we put a little, um, we can put a graph in the show notes as well, but really just showing, like sometimes when we first come to Christ, we think like that's the biggest the Gospel's ever gonna be like, I just got saved.

It'll never be any bigger than it is this moment, but really what we begin to see is throughout our lives the glory and grace of God grow so much as. Really understand who God is, what he's done for us, how much he loves us, and really then that is the, under the full understanding of that comes in glorification when we're with him.

But I know for me, I think I told you the year I turned 50, you know I wept. Mm-hmm. That entire year I cried so much because I felt like the cross. Had never been as big to me as it was. 25 years into coming to Saving Faith. I just wept and wept because I was like, oh, after all these years, after all of everything I've done, after all the ways you know I am, you still just love me.

Mm-hmm. I was completely overwhelmed. Completely overwhelmed, and I still, it makes me teary-eyed because I just really, I, I think like you're saying, the cross just grows bigger and the understanding of that, what my justification means, um, yeah, it just is, it becomes more overwhelming. Mm-hmm. And that affection makes me want to love God and to serve him and to tell other people about him.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's so good. Yeah. Well, I hope we've taken a really big concept that volumes have been written about and made it somewhat useful and somewhat palatable in just saying these three big concepts. Um, Maybe they're, they're more simple now and understandable and relatable and workable, and they're important in our lives and they, um, are important in the way that we interact with other people.